{"id":28516,"date":"2024-07-08T04:36:10","date_gmt":"2024-07-08T11:36:10","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/writersfunzone.com\/blog\/?p=28516"},"modified":"2024-07-08T04:39:23","modified_gmt":"2024-07-08T11:39:23","slug":"interview-with-michael-kilman-co-author-of-build-better-worlds-part-1-of-2","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/writersfunzone.com\/blog\/2024\/07\/08\/interview-with-michael-kilman-co-author-of-build-better-worlds-part-1-of-2\/","title":{"rendered":"Interview with Michael Kilman, co-author of Build Better Worlds, part 1 of 2"},"content":{"rendered":"<p style=\"text-align: center;\"><a href=\"https:\/\/writersfunzone.com\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/07\/Episode-108-Blog-Images.png\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"alignnone wp-image-28517 size-full\" title=\"Interview with Michael Kilman, co-author of Build Better Worlds, part 1 of 2\" src=\"https:\/\/writersfunzone.com\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/07\/Episode-108-Blog-Images.png\" alt=\"Blog Title and Images of Beth Barany and Michael Kilman for Interview with Michael Kilman, co-author of Build Better Worlds, part 1 of 2\" width=\"300\" height=\"300\" srcset=\"https:\/\/writersfunzone.com\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/07\/Episode-108-Blog-Images.png 300w, https:\/\/writersfunzone.com\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/07\/Episode-108-Blog-Images-80x80.png 80w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 300px) 100vw, 300px\" \/><\/a><\/p>\n<p><a href=\"https:\/\/writersfunzone.com\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/07\/Episode-108-Blog-Images-1.png\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"alignnone wp-image-28518 size-full aligncenter\" title=\"Quote from Interview with Michael Kilman, co-author of Build Better Worlds, part 1 of 2\" src=\"https:\/\/writersfunzone.com\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/07\/Episode-108-Blog-Images-1.png\" alt=\"Quote from Interview with Michael Kilman, co-author of Build Better Worlds, part 1 of 2\" width=\"300\" height=\"300\" srcset=\"https:\/\/writersfunzone.com\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/07\/Episode-108-Blog-Images-1.png 300w, https:\/\/writersfunzone.com\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/07\/Episode-108-Blog-Images-1-80x80.png 80w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 300px) 100vw, 300px\" \/><\/a><\/p>\n<h2 style=\"text-align: center;\"><span class=\"notion-enable-hover\" data-token-index=\"0\">Interview with Michael Kilman, co-author of Build Better Worlds, part 1 of 2 &#8211; <\/span>How To Write the Future podcast, episode 108<\/h2>\n<p><i><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u201cI think if you&#8217;re writing truthfully, because that&#8217;s what we&#8217;re trying to do a lot of times as author, telling a good story, but being honest in our writing and in terms of the human experience, I think it really helps to have some sort of guidepost for how do we build these human experiences?\u201d &#8211; Michael Kilman\u00a0<\/span><\/i><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Following on from the mini series where podcast host Beth Barany delved into the book <\/span><i><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Build Better Worlds<\/span><\/i><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> by Michael Kilman and Kyra Wellstrom, in this latest episode Beth chats to co-author Michael Kilman about his history and interest in anthropology and how it helped shape chapters of the book, titled \u201cInterview with Michael Kilman, co-author of Build Better Worlds, part 1 of 2.\u201d <\/span><\/p>\n<p><!-- notionvc: 482b5613-dbe3-4d27-a4a8-a3cf6f7b7b7c --><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Platforms The podcast is available on <a href=\"https:\/\/podcasts.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/108-interview-with-michael-kilman-co-author-of\/id1641025914?i=1000661500453\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\">Apple Podcasts<\/a> | <a href=\"https:\/\/www.buzzsprout.com\/2012061\/15339005-108-interview-with-michael-kilman-co-author-of-build-better-worlds-part-1-of-2\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\">Buzzsprout<\/a> | <a href=\"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/episode\/2g3xouldNpH9fGvXNHTrLK\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\">Spotify<\/a> | <a href=\"https:\/\/podcastaddict.com\/episode\/https%3A%2F%2Fwww.buzzsprout.com%2F2012061%2F15339005-108-interview-with-michael-kilman-co-author-of-build-better-worlds-part-1-of-2.mp3&amp;podcastId=4025186\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\">Podcast Addict<\/a> | <a href=\"https:\/\/music.amazon.com\/podcasts\/ca590618-5630-4450-aa17-7e2f35359a76\/episodes\/5b98d113-61f1-4e5a-8c6a-e35f15329dfe\/how-to-write-the-future-108-interview-with-michael-kilman-co-author-of-build-better-worlds-part-1-of-2\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\">Amazon Music<\/a> | <a href=\"https:\/\/youtu.be\/T9lGr75uKTk?si=KkthgvaYQpYy-yZB\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\">Youtube<\/a><\/span><\/p>\n<p style=\"text-align: center;\"><iframe loading=\"lazy\" title=\"YouTube video player\" src=\"https:\/\/www.youtube.com\/embed\/T9lGr75uKTk?si=KkthgvaYQpYy-yZB\" width=\"560\" height=\"315\" frameborder=\"0\" allowfullscreen=\"allowfullscreen\"><\/iframe><\/p>\n<p><script type='text\/javascript' charset='utf-8' src='https:\/\/www.buzzsprout.com\/2012061.js?container_id=buzzsprout-large-player&#038;player=large'><\/script><\/p>\n<h2><b>RESOURCES\u00a0<\/b><\/h2>\n<p><b>Build Better Worlds: An Introduction to Anthropology for Game Designers, Fiction Writers and Filmmakers<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> by Michael Kilman and Kyra Wellstrom<\/span><a href=\"https:\/\/books2read.com\/bbwhtwtf\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\"> <span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">https:\/\/books2read.com\/bbwhtwtf<\/span><\/a><\/p>\n<p><b>Playlist for Build Better Worlds HTWTF Mini-series:<\/b><\/p>\n<p><a href=\"https:\/\/youtube.com\/playlist?list=PLFt3x70-_d9J3YFYX5x630CwrsJ5gTml0&amp;si=4lIavBcopfu4hVKn\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\"><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">https:\/\/youtube.com\/playlist?list=PLFt3x70-_d9J3YFYX5x630CwrsJ5gTml0&amp;si=4lIavBcopfu4hVKn<\/span><\/a><\/p>\n<p><b>Free World Building Workbook for Fiction Writers:<\/b><a href=\"https:\/\/writersfunzone.com\/blog\/world-building-resources\/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\"> <span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">https:\/\/writersfunzone.com\/blog\/world-building-resources\/<\/span><\/a><\/p>\n<p><b>Sign up for the 30-minute Story Success Clinic with Beth Barany:<\/b><a href=\"https:\/\/writersfunzone.com\/blog\/story-success-clinic\/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\"> <span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">https:\/\/writersfunzone.com\/blog\/story-success-clinic\/<\/span><\/a><\/p>\n<p><b>Get support for your fiction writing by a novelist and writing teacher and coach. Schedule an exploratory call here and see if Beth can support you today:<\/b> <a href=\"https:\/\/writersfunzone.com\/blog\/discovery-call\/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\"><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">https:\/\/writersfunzone.com\/blog\/discovery-call\/<\/span><\/a><\/p>\n<h2><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">About the How To Write the Future podcast\u00a0<\/span><\/h2>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">The *How To Write The Future* podcast is for science fiction and fantasy writers who want to write positive futures and successfully bring those stories out into the marketplace. Hosted by Beth Barany, science fiction novelist and creativity coach for writers. We cover tips for fiction writers. This podcast is for readers too if you\u2019re at all curious about the future of humanity.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">This podcast is for you if you have questions like:<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">&#8211; How do I create a believable world for my science fiction story?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">&#8211; How do I figure out what&#8217;s not working if my story feels flat?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">&#8211; How do I make my story more interesting and alive?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">This podcast is for readers too if you\u2019re at all curious about the future of humanity.<\/span><\/p>\n<h2>ABOUT Michael Kilman<\/h2>\n<p><a href=\"https:\/\/writersfunzone.com\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/07\/Winter-Wizard-Me-Loridians-Laboratory-LLC-1.jpg\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"alignleft wp-image-28520 size-medium\" title=\"Image of Michael Kilman\" src=\"https:\/\/writersfunzone.com\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/07\/Winter-Wizard-Me-Loridians-Laboratory-LLC-1-300x225.jpg\" alt=\"Image of Michael Kilman\" width=\"300\" height=\"225\" srcset=\"https:\/\/writersfunzone.com\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/07\/Winter-Wizard-Me-Loridians-Laboratory-LLC-1-300x225.jpg 300w, https:\/\/writersfunzone.com\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/07\/Winter-Wizard-Me-Loridians-Laboratory-LLC-1-768x576.jpg 768w, https:\/\/writersfunzone.com\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/07\/Winter-Wizard-Me-Loridians-Laboratory-LLC-1-640x480.jpg 640w, https:\/\/writersfunzone.com\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/2024\/07\/Winter-Wizard-Me-Loridians-Laboratory-LLC-1.jpg 960w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 300px) 100vw, 300px\" \/><\/a><\/p>\n<p>Michael Kilman is an author and anthropologist. He lectures at the University of Colorado at Denver and is host of the YouTube series Anthropology in 10 or Less. His graduate research focused on the Romero Theater Troupe, a community organization that seeks to address stereotypes in media and gives a space for individuals to share their stories and represent themselves. After teaching anthropology for 9 years and working with 25 native American Tribes over the course of ten years, Michael published four science fiction novels in a series called The Chronicles of the Great Migration. His most recent co-written book, Build Better Worlds: An Introduction to Anthropology, for Game Designers, Fiction Writers, and Filmmakers, uses the social science of anthropology to help people with fictional worldbuilding. As a documentary filmmaker Michael has produced several documentaries including the short form pieces titled Native American History in Colorado and the Language Hunters. His long form documentaries include Unbound: The Story of the Romero Theater Troupe and The Crossroads at Stonewall. Michael Gave a Ted Talk in September 2021 titled, Anthropology, Our Imagination, and How to Understand Difference. Michael was elected President of the High Plains Society for Applied Anthropology in 2020 and served as president until May 2022. He is currently working on a Dark Fantasy\/Horror novel titled Shades and Shapes in the Dark.<\/p>\n<p>Facebook: <a href=\"https:\/\/www.facebook.com\/michael.kilman.5\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\">https:\/\/www.facebook.com\/michael.kilman.5<\/a><\/p>\n<p>LinkedIn: <a href=\"https:\/\/www.linkedin.com\/in\/michael-kilman-m-s-075b7110\/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\">https:\/\/www.linkedin.com\/in\/michael-kilman-m-s-075b7110\/<\/a><\/p>\n<p>Tiktok: <a href=\"https:\/\/www.tiktok.com\/@authormichaelkilman\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\">https:\/\/www.tiktok.com\/@authormichaelkilman<\/a><\/p>\n<p>Website: <a href=\"http:\/\/loridianslaboratory.com\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\">http:\/\/loridianslaboratory.com<\/a><\/p>\n<p><!-- notionvc: 1b45edac-e9ae-4d0c-b16e-e18f3d78934e --><\/p>\n<h2><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Transcript for Michael Kilman, Co-Author of Build Better Worlds, part 1 of 2<\/span><\/h2>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Hello everyone. Welcome back or welcome to How to Write the Future Podcast. I&#8217;m your host, Beth Barany. I&#8217;m a creativity coach for writers and a science fiction and fantasy writer. I run this podcast because I believe that as writers, we can create positive, optimistic futures because when we do, we actually help shape the world through our stories.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Also by being a writer and thinking deeply about humanity and new cultures that we put into our stories, we can also reshape ourselves.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<h3><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Introducing Today&#8217;s Guest, Michael Kilman<\/span><\/h3>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Today I have a special guest with me, Michael Kilman, an author, and I&#8217;m gonna tell you about his book, <\/span><i><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Build Better Worlds<\/span><\/i><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">, in a moment.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">But I just wanna welcome you in, Michael. Thank you so much for joining us today.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Thank you for having me.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Yeah, this will be fun. So I am gonna introduce y&#8217;all to Michael, and for those of you watching on YouTube, you&#8217;ll be able to see our faces So here is, Michael&#8217;s bio, and I&#8217;ll just say that this book <\/span><i><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Build Better Worlds<\/span><\/i><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">, which I&#8217;m gonna be talking a lot about and holding it up probably a few times, with all my post-Its, is called<\/span><i><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> Build Better Worlds: an Introduction to Anthropology for Game Designers, Fiction Writers and Filmmakers<\/span><\/i><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">, and it&#8217;s co-written. Michael co-wrote this book with Kyra Wellstrom and, Kyra can&#8217;t be with us today, so we&#8217;re gonna have to have another conversation with her later.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">So about Michael.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<h3><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">About Michael\u00a0<\/span><\/h3>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Michael is an author and anthropologist. He lectures at the University of Colorado at Denver and is host of the YouTube series, anthropology in 10 or less. His graduate research focused on the Romero Theater Troupe, a community organization that seeks to address stereotypes in media and gives a space for individuals to share their stories and represent themselves.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">After teaching anthropology for nine years and working with 25 Native American tribes over the course of 10 years, Michael published four science fiction novels in a series called <\/span><i><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">The Chronicles of the Great Migration<\/span><\/i><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">. His most recent co-written book,<\/span><i><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> Build Better Worlds<\/span><\/i><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> and <\/span><i><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Anthropology: An Introduction To Anthropology For Game Designers, Fiction Writers And Filmmakers<\/span><\/i><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> uses the social science of anthropology to help people with fictional world-building. As a documentary filmmaker, Michael has produced several documentaries, including the short-form pieces titled Native American History in Colorado: The Language Hunters. His long-form documentaries include Unbound, the story of the Romero Theater Troupe, and the Crossroads at Stonewall.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Michael gave a TED Talk in September 2021 entitled Anthropology, our Imagination, and How to Understand the Difference. Michael was elected president of the High Plains Society for Applied Anthropology in 2020 and served as president until May 2022. He&#8217;s currently working on a dark fantasy horror novel titled<\/span><i><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> Shades and Shapes in the Dark.<\/span><\/i><\/p>\n<h3><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">On To The Interview\u00a0<\/span><\/h3>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Wow. So cool. Welcome Michael. I&#8217;m so excited to talk with you. I love this wide range of-you&#8217;ve done so many things. I didn&#8217;t realize that it didn&#8217;t quite register that you&#8217;ve done, film making and, and also all the fiction you&#8217;ve created. So, so fun, lots to talk about. Thanks again for being here Gosh, where do I begin?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">I have a lot of questions for you and you also gave me some fabulous prep questions to start with. backing up a little bit about you: like why anthropology? Why did you decide to study anthropology?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">I think I&#8217;m just a really curious person. I like to engage and study different aspects of the human experience. When I was in high school, I had aspirations of being a rock star and various other things. It started out my college career in music, but, switched a whole bunch of times and randomly took an anthropology class and realized this is what feeds my curiosity.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Really understanding how people tick and as long as I can remember, I was always very interested in other cultures and other experiences. I was always very aware that there were a lot of different ways of being in the world. I was also, like everybody else, I grew up in my little bubble.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">And once I got outside of that bubble, I just became fascinated with all the different kinds of ways of thinking about the world.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Oh, that&#8217;s wonderful. I have a similar eclectic upbringing and always curious about other cultures. I was almost an anthropology major in college but ended up doing an interdisciplinary degree.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">You&#8217;ve really dug in, you&#8217;re not just studying, but you&#8217;re creating things- your documentaries, your novels, the nonfiction book. And you mentioned before when we were in the green room that you&#8217;re considering doing another edition. a second edition, is that right?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Yeah, we wanted to, I think there&#8217;s a couple of chapters we wanted to expand. And there was a couple of chapters that when we originally did the book we had talked about, but it&#8217;s already 400 pages. How much longer do we wanna make this thing? there&#8217;s also been some changes, in the fossil record and those kinds of things.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">and that&#8217;s Kyra. Kyra is the biological anthropologist. She specializes in forensics. That&#8217;s where her graduate research is. She did all of the very wonderful biological and environmental chapters and, some of the cultural ones too, like the gender chapter and the health chapter as well.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">So she did a lot of the stuff that deals with much more with the physical realities Of being a human. I leaned more towards the cultural, however. We both argued who got to write the Monster chapter because we both wanted to do it.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Yeah. Oh my goodness.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">So we collaborated on that.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">All of our chapters basically were because we both have taught many subjects in anthropology. But we both have been teaching, actually, really I&#8217;m coming up on my decade anniversary of teaching now. So, she&#8217;s a very well-versed person in these areas.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">and we would basically write the first draft of the chapter and then handed over to the other person and have them edit it and add what they knew from the topic. It was very collaborative and she was a wonderful co-author to work with.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Oh, that&#8217;s fabulous. Yeah. And just due to technical difficulties, Kara couldn&#8217;t be here today, so we&#8217;ll definitely have to have her back. so listeners know, I did four episodes on four different sections in your book and like one on economics, one on just the whole notion of context, one on religion.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">I&#8217;m spacing on the fourth. I found it so juicy. And your book has -just a big plug for your book-. Great thinking questions. And so I was taking your questions and asking the listeners, how does this apply to your story world? yeah. Such great food for thought.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">I really encourage everyone to check out the book. Why is anthropology and social science important for people to consider in their fiction and world building?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">I think. If you&#8217;re writing truthfully, because that&#8217;s what we&#8217;re trying to do a lot of times as author, telling a good story, but being honest in our writing and in terms of the human experience, I think it really helps to have some sort of guidepost for How do we build these human experiences?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">How do we think about how humans organize and move through the world? How do people get biases? Or how do they overcome those things or how do things change? and looking at that in authentic ways. you can do this of course, by going out into the world and experiencing cultures, but\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">We know that not everybody has that kind of privilege to be able go out and travel and do things, Yeah.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">I understand how difficult it can be to get out of the house, but we wanted to give people an opportunity to really explore some of those core concepts. This is not a complete guide, and it certainly doesn&#8217;t cover every aspect of anthropology. It would have to be thousands of pages long for that. It&#8217;s a good introduction and we really thought that even just getting a little social science knowledge into people&#8217;s head would be really useful, especially when they&#8217;re crafting worlds from scratch.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">It&#8217;s one thing to write about our own world and you can certainly observe a lot of things. to build a fantasy world from scratch, for example, is a huge undertaking.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">As anyone who&#8217;s tried to do it as, like myself has known, you spend many hundreds of hours thinking about how does this world function. It&#8217;s useful to know how the human world functions. Even if you&#8217;re writing a reptilian species or something like that, it&#8217;s useful understand how the biological elements of yourself impact the creation of culture and how the environment impacts the creation of culture, and how culture can be an adaptive tool for survival.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">I love what you just said. Those three things are really basic elements and when we&#8217;re in our day-to-day lives, or even, I&#8217;ve met writers who they&#8217;ll think a lot about their characters, but they won&#8217;t necessarily think about why the world that they just came to them through their imagination might be shaped that way even.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">A piece of guidance that I like to always give is think of your point of view character. Your point of view character knows what they know, and start with them, interview them, and ask them what do they know. And if I were to ask you, so you know, the way your city is laid out, do you know why it&#8217;s laid out that way?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">And you may or may not know, right?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Right.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">But you might have some ideas about how cities get built and that&#8217;s enough cultural knowledge to, to, if you&#8217;re writing from point of view character who only knows, generally in our, cities are built like this, then that is part of your character&#8217;s understanding of culture and you can use that to, to build upon.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Yeah, and I think it&#8217;s great to focus on your characters. I think characters are the core and backbone of your world, but like a real person, your character is going to be limited in their knowledge and experience. And having those limitations is part of the story. If your character knows everything there is to know about the world, there&#8217;s no room for them to grow.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">In reality, as individuals, we&#8217;re pushed and pulled by cultural systems in ways that we don&#8217;t know or understand. And I think as Americans, we don&#8217;t like to hear that. We really don&#8217;t like the idea that the culture determines so much of the ways we think and move through the world because we wanna just really focus on that individual.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">I remember after I finished grad school, I ended up doing some mock jury for trying to make some money in the meantime. And I remember thinking, I&#8217;ve got a graduate degree. These lawyers can&#8217;t push me in one direction or another. And I found in this mock jury, which they&#8217;re very much using to try to figure out how to phrase their argument for court.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">This is, when you have a wealthy client, they have the means to do this. They very much led me by the nose and I realized it at the end and I was like, oh my God. They very much manipulated me and used my blind spots and I was like, here I have an advanced degree. Cultural systems push us in directions that we don&#8217;t understand.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">And I think, when you&#8217;re building a fictional world, you need to understand what cultural forces are gonna be putting pressure on your characters that they don&#8217;t necessarily understand. We all function that way. We don&#8217;t really understand everything we do.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Some of us end up in therapy to try to figure out why we do the things we do, right? You could be your character&#8217;s therapist and sorts, and like how did they get this way? How did their childhood, how did the historical context, how did all these things lead up to them thinking in this particular way at this particular moment?\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<h3><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Write Long and Prosper\u00a0<\/span><\/h3>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">That&#8217;s it for this week. Stay tuned to next week where I continue my conversation with Michael, about his book,<\/span><i><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> Build Better Worlds<\/span><\/i><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">And I just wanna tell all of our listeners to write long and prosper.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<h3><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Loved this episode? Leave us a review and rating here: <\/span><a href=\"https:\/\/www.buzzsprout.com\/2012061\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\"><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">https:\/\/www.buzzsprout.com\/2012061<\/span><\/a><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0<\/span><\/h3>\n<h2><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">ABOUT BETH BARANY\u00a0<\/span><\/h2>\n<p><a href=\"https:\/\/writersfunzone.com\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/2023\/11\/BETH-BARANY_2023_300px_01-e1701116328224.webp\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"alignleft wp-image-27766 size-full\" title=\"Image of Beth Barany\" src=\"https:\/\/writersfunzone.com\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/2023\/11\/BETH-BARANY_2023_300px_01-e1701116328224.webp\" alt=\"Image of Beth Barany\" width=\"200\" height=\"200\" \/><\/a><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Beth Barany teaches science fiction and fantasy novelists how to write, edit, and publish their books as a coach, teacher, consultant, and developmental editor. She\u2019s an award-winning fantasy and science fiction novelist and runs the podcast, \u201cHow To Write The Future.\u201d<\/span><\/p>\n<p>&nbsp;<\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Learn more about Beth Barany at these sites:\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p>&nbsp;<\/p>\n<p><a href=\"http:\/\/author.bethbarany.com\/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\"><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Author site<\/span><\/a><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> \/\u00a0 <\/span><a href=\"http:\/\/bethbarany.com\/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\"><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Coaching site<\/span><\/a><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> \/ <\/span><a href=\"http:\/\/baranyschooloffiction.com\/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\"><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">School of Fiction<\/span><\/a><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> \/ <\/span><a href=\"http:\/\/www.writersfunzone.com\/blog\/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\"><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Writer\u2019s Fun Zone blog<\/span><\/a><\/p>\n<h2><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">CONNECT\u00a0<\/span><\/h2>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Contact Beth: <a href=\"https:\/\/writersfunzone.com\/blog\/podcast\/#tve-jump-185b4422580\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\">https:\/\/writersfunzone.com\/blog\/podcast\/#tve-jump-185b4422580<\/a><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">Email: beth@bethbarany.com<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">LinkedIn: <\/span><a href=\"https:\/\/www.linkedin.com\/in\/bethbarany\/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\"><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">https:\/\/www.linkedin.com\/in\/bethbarany\/<\/span><\/a><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">IG: <a href=\"https:\/\/www.instagram.com\/bethbarany\/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\">https:\/\/www.instagram.com\/bethbarany\/<\/a><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">TT: <a href=\"https:\/\/www.tiktok.com\/@bethbarany\/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\">https:\/\/www.tiktok.com\/@bethbarany\/<\/a><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">FB: <a href=\"https:\/\/www.facebook.com\/bethbarany\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\">https:\/\/www.facebook.com\/bethbarany<\/a><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">X: <\/span><a href=\"https:\/\/twitter.com\/BethBarany\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\"><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">https:\/\/twitter.com\/BethBarany<\/span><\/a><\/p>\n<h2><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">CREDITS\u00a0<\/span><\/h2>\n<ul>\n<li style=\"font-weight: 400;\" aria-level=\"1\"><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">EDITED WITH DESCRIPT:<\/span><a href=\"https:\/\/www.descript.com?lmref=_w1WCA\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\"> <span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">https:\/\/www.descript.com?lmref=_w1WCA<\/span><\/a><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> (Refer-a-Friend link)<\/span><\/li>\n<li style=\"font-weight: 400;\" aria-level=\"1\"><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">MUSIC CREDITS : Music from Uppbeat (free for Creators!):<\/span><a href=\"https:\/\/uppbeat.io\/t\/soundroll\/fuzz-buzz\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\"> <span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">https:\/\/uppbeat.io\/t\/soundroll\/fuzz-buzz<\/span><\/a><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> License code: UMMKDRL02DFGKJ0L. \u201cFuzz buzz\u201d by Soundroll. Commercial license:<\/span><a href=\"https:\/\/musicvine.com\/track\/soundroll\/fuzz-buzz\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\"> <span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">https:\/\/musicvine.com\/track\/soundroll\/fuzz-buzz<\/span><\/a><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">.<\/span><\/li>\n<li style=\"font-weight: 400;\" aria-level=\"1\"><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">DISTRIBUTED BY BUZZSPROUT:<\/span><a href=\"https:\/\/www.buzzsprout.com\/?referrer_id=1994465\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\"> <span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">https:\/\/www.buzzsprout.com\/?referrer_id=1994465<\/span><\/a><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\"> (Refer-a-Friend link)<\/span><\/li>\n<li style=\"font-weight: 400;\" aria-level=\"1\"><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">SHOW PRODUCTION BY Beth Barany<\/span><\/li>\n<li style=\"font-weight: 400;\" aria-level=\"1\"><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">SHOW CO-PRODUCTION + NOTES by Kerry-Ann McDade<\/span><\/li>\n<\/ul>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">C 2024 BETH BARANY<\/span><\/p>\n<p><a href=\"https:\/\/bethbarany.com\/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\"><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">https:\/\/bethbarany.com\/<\/span><\/a><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">For more \u201cHow To Write the Future\u201d episodes, go <\/span><a href=\"https:\/\/writersfunzone.com\/blog\/podcast\/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\"><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">here.<\/span><\/a><\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Interview with Michael Kilman, co-author of Build Better Worlds, part 1 of 2 &#8211; How To Write the Future podcast, episode 108 \u201cI think if you&#8217;re writing truthfully, because that&#8217;s what we&#8217;re trying to&#46;&#46;&#46;<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":18,"featured_media":28517,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"_exactmetrics_skip_tracking":false,"_exactmetrics_sitenote_active":false,"_exactmetrics_sitenote_note":"","_exactmetrics_sitenote_category":0,"footnotes":""},"categories":[5099],"tags":[],"class_list":["post-28516","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-how-to-write-the-future-podcast"],"yoast_head":"<!-- This site is optimized with the Yoast SEO plugin v27.4 - https:\/\/yoast.com\/product\/yoast-seo-wordpress\/ -->\n<title>Interview with Michael Kilman, co-author of Build Better Worlds, part 1 of 2 &#183; Writer&#039;s Fun Zone<\/title>\n<meta name=\"description\" content=\"In this Interview with Michael Kilman, he shares about his history and interest in anthropology and how it helped shape chapters of the book.\" \/>\n<meta name=\"robots\" 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